Final Fantasy Re-Releases Ruins Pureness

[stryphos]

There are 2 iterations of the PSP cable, a composite and component. If I recall correctly, in order to have higher resolution gameplay on your TV, you need to have the component cable.

[miketheratguy]

I haven't used my psp tv cable in forever so I can't be absolutely certain but I believe that you're right, it is in fact a component cable. Then again I think that the system can use a composite cable as well. I don't really remember what the deal was, other than knowing that I was only able to use the cable that I did because my system was hacked. But yeah, excellent system. A hacked psp and a hefty memory stick means a portable gaming device that's storing a dozen psp games and hundreds of NES, SNES and Genesis games. Even some arcade titles.

As for FF7, I bought it the week it was released and played it through to completion. At the time I enjoyed it, it's a good game. The only reason that I look back on it as overrated is because of the crummy characters, the hot mess of a plot, the bad dialogue, the underwhelming soundtrack, the lame non-ending, the smaller party size, the characters' lack of any real practical uniqueness, the overuse of corny designations and acronyms, the dearth of noteworthy character development for all but a handful of the cast, the glut of gimmicky minigames, the hyperbolic ad campaign, the overzealous fan worship, the masturbatory frenzy over the boring antagonist, the fact that the game has gotten half a dozen spinoffs and a profoundly awful CGI movie, Square's desire to include a spiky-haired androgynous emo in virtually every successive game, the popular belief that FF7 is somehow not only the best game in the series but also one of the absolute best games ever made...

As for FF7, I hope I don't sound too pessimistic for saying that no matter how you feel about the merits of the game itself, the only reason it became a huge success in America was because people were wowed by the pre-rendered cinematics so prominently featured in the ad campaign.

This.

And by "so prominently featured" you mean "featured this and literally nothing else". It's funny that just a few years later people bitched and made it an industry controversy when Call of Duty 2 pulled essentially the same trick..

[te72]

As for FF7, I hope I don't sound too pessimistic for saying that no matter how you feel about the merits of the game itself, the only reason it became a huge success in America was because people were wowed by the pre-rendered cinematics so prominently featured in the ad campaign.

It was quite well marketed, I do recall that much.

There are 2 iterations of the PSP cable, a composite and component. If I recall correctly, in order to have higher resolution gameplay on your TV, you need to have the component cable.

Ahh, I stand corrected. Would definitely need a component cable to get a higher resolution than 480 though.

As for FF7, I bought it the week it was released and played it through to completion. At the time I enjoyed it, it's a good game. The only reason that I look back on it as overrated is because of the crummy characters, the hot mess of a plot, the bad dialogue, the underwhelming soundtrack, the lame non-ending, the smaller party size, the characters' lack of any real practical uniqueness, the overuse of corny designations and acronyms, the dearth of noteworthy character development for all but a handful of the cast, the glut of gimmicky minigames, the hyperbolic ad campaign, the overzealous fan worship, the masturbatory frenzy over the boring antagonist, the fact that the game has gotten half a dozen spinoffs and a profoundly awful CGI movie, Square's desire to include a spiky-haired androgynous emo in virtually every successive game, the popular belief that FF7 is somehow not only the best game in the series but also one of the absolute best games ever made...

This.

And by "so prominently featured" you mean "featured this and literally nothing else". It's funny that just a few years later people bitched and made it an industry controversy when Call of Duty 2 pulled essentially the same trick..

I do believe you might have allowed the internet to corrupt your opinion over the years. I'll admit that the EU was largely pointless, and more detrimental than helpful. I can only really make any sound arguments on three of your points:

-The music was every bit as lovely as anything in a Square game before it. It particularly set the tone of the scene presented. I find it be one of the high points.

-The smaller party size may have been a consequence of moving to 3d. I appreciate that it made you focus on what you did have in your party, and this is coming from a diehard Suikoden fan.

-About it being the best FF game... perhaps not. I loved 6 and 9 quite a lot. But I don't think I've ever went back to play them again... I've played through 7 and 8 quite a few times. It is however, one of the best games I've ever played. We might not have a PS4 by now if this game had been on the N64 like it was originally planned to be... that has to count for something. True, a million screaming idiots are still idiots, but eventually you have to wonder why they're all screaming.

As for the marketing, they showed FF7 gameplay. Perhaps it was overshadowed by the FMV, but what game that had it wasn't putting its best foot forward back in the mid 90's?

[miketheratguy]

I do believe you might have allowed the internet to corrupt your opinion over the years. I'll admit that the EU was largely pointless, and more detrimental than helpful. I can only really make any sound arguments on three of your points:

-The music was every bit as lovely as anything in a Square game before it. It particularly set the tone of the scene presented. I find it be one of the high points.

-The smaller party size may have been a consequence of moving to 3d. I appreciate that it made you focus on what you did have in your party, and this is coming from a diehard Suikoden fan.

-About it being the best FF game... perhaps not. I loved 6 and 9 quite a lot. But I don't think I've ever went back to play them again... I've played through 7 and 8 quite a few times. It is however, one of the best games I've ever played. We might not have a PS4 by now if this game had been on the N64 like it was originally planned to be... that has to count for something. True, a million screaming idiots are still idiots, but eventually you have to wonder why they're all screaming.

As for the marketing, they showed FF7 gameplay. Perhaps it was overshadowed by the FMV, but what game that had it wasn't putting its best foot forward back in the mid 90's?

I'm afraid that, for better or worse, the majority of my impressions of FFVII were formed the first time that I played it. I threw myself into the game, like I did with all Final Fantasy titles up to that point, and found myself oddly detached from it. It didn't feel anything like the previous games in the series, including even the Gameboy titles. It was epic in scope and definitely felt like a Final Fantasy game, it just felt worse in almost every respect. I didn't feel much of a sense of accomplishment when I finished it, nothing really resembling the feeling of satisfaction and joy at having gone through what should have been a deeply rewarding journey. By the time I was done I couldn't care less about the vast majority of the characters, was completely underwhelmed by the ending and no less confused about the plot, and had no particularly strong feelings about any of what I'd experienced (with the exception of Aeris' death). I could only remember a couple of pieces from the soundtrack and had no great urge to start back over and play the game a second time. In short, while I did enjoy playing through Final Fantasy VII and don't regret having done so, it didn't leave any great impression on me. When it was finished I turned off the Playstation and thought "That's it? Huh. It was good I guess".

The only bearing that the internet had on my opinion was the shock and confusion I felt at seeing how feverishly the game had been (and continues to be) embraced by an obsessive, doe-eyed and reverent gaming public - seemingly consisting primarily of kids who'd never been exposed to an RPG before. It saddens me to think that the exaggerated reputation that I feel the game earned came not from an objective appraisal of its quality but rather the ignorance of many of its supporters. Everyone's free to love the game, of course. To each their own. I just have a hard time reconciling the quantity of the adoration with the demonstrable quality of the game. Why are a million idiots screaming? Because they're idiots. That's what they do.

I honestly recall seeing no gameplay footage in any of the commercials that I was exposed to. Not one second of it. I would never claim that NONE of them showed any, but if they did then I certainly didn't see them. What I did see was crap like this, and I saw it constantly. FMV cutscenes? Oh you betcha! Here's all the exploding, flashing, motorcycle riding FMV cutscenes anyone could ask for and more. Shit, the game might as well have been titled "IT'S PURTY SO BUY IT". Gameplay? Not even the fleetest hint of it.

[te72]

I'm afraid that, for better or worse, the majority of my impressions of FFVII were formed the first time that I played it. I threw myself into the game, like I did with all Final Fantasy titles up to that point, and found myself oddly detached from it. It didn't feel anything like the previous games in the series, including even the Gameboy titles. It was epic in scope and definitely felt like a Final Fantasy game, it just felt worse in almost every respect. I didn't feel much of a sense of accomplishment when I finished it, nothing really resembling the feeling of satisfaction and joy at having gone through what should have been a deeply rewarding journey. By the time I was done I couldn't care less about the vast majority of the characters, was completely underwhelmed by the ending and no less confused about the plot, and had no particularly strong feelings about any of what I'd experienced (with the exception of Aeris' death). I could only remember a couple of pieces from the soundtrack and had no great urge to start back over and play the game a second time. In short, while I did enjoy playing through Final Fantasy VII and don't regret having done so, it didn't leave any great impression on me. When it was finished I turned off the Playstation and thought "That's it? Huh. It was good I guess".

The only bearing that the internet had on my opinion was the shock and confusion I felt at seeing how feverishly the game had been (and continues to be) embraced by an obsessive, doe-eyed and reverent gaming public - seemingly consisting primarily of kids who'd never been exposed to an RPG before. It saddens me to think that the exaggerated reputation that I feel the game earned came not from an objective appraisal of its quality but rather the ignorance of many of its supporters. Everyone's free to love the game, of course. To each their own. I just have a hard time reconciling the quantity of the adoration with the demonstrable quality of the game. Why are a million idiots screaming? Because they're idiots. That's what they do.

I honestly recall seeing no gameplay footage in any of the commercials that I was exposed to. Not one second of it. I would never claim that NONE of them showed any, but if they did then I certainly didn't see them. What I did see was crap like this, and I saw it constantly. FMV cutscenes? Oh you betcha! Here's all the exploding, flashing, motorcycle riding FMV cutscenes anyone could ask for and more. Shit, the game might as well have been titled "IT'S PURTY SO BUY IT". Gameplay? Not even the fleetest hint of it.

Very interesting points Mike. The way I see it, is that people seem to fall into one of two camps. Either they played RPGs, and often FF games BEFORE FF7, or FF7 was their first RPG. The only other guy I've talked to much about 7 that shared your dissent of it was a long time FF fan, dating back to the NES era. He shared a lot of the criticisms you have.

Personally, I played FF Mystic Quest, Secret of Mana, FF Adventure (on the Gameboy), Suikoden, and finally, Wild Arms, before FF7 came out. Mystic Quest was a joke, albeit a decent "starter" rpg for the time. Secret of Mana, really don't need to say much about that one, it's a classic that holds up quite well today, apart from some of the grindy bits... FF Adventure was basically a Zelda game. Suikoden is also a classic, perhaps the pinnacle of 2d rpg gaming as far as I'm concerned. Wild Arms was an interesting sort of game, with 2d maps and 3d battles, I still intend to play through it again at some point.

However, for me... FF7 was unlike anything I had played up to that point. Remember, MGS hasn't come out. Most of the major, large scope games of that era hadn't come out yet. Sure, SNES and Genesis had a FEW long games, but nothing quite like the scale of your first play through of FF7. So unless you were into PC gaming, it was unlikely you had played such a game with such grand designs for your entire winter... and spring... and possibly the following summer.

I will concede that I was also a bit 'meh' about the ending myself. While it was good to be done with it, it wasn't really as satisfying as many of the other moments in the game. Midgar as a whole, battling the weapons, getting the airship, breeding your own chocobos, toying with the battle system and its endless possibilities... Although I will say that the final dungeon is still a great one, full of intrigue and mystery.

However, as often happens with a story so long, it can be easy to get a bit lost in it, or forget details here and there. This is another reason I recommended that LP from that Elentor guy. I tried replaying the game back in 2010 on the PSP I had bought, and I might have made it a solid third of the way through the game before realizing I just wasn't enjoying it that much. However, I still enjoy new ways of seeing games I liked, and Elentor's LP is something you should look into. I'll even link it below for you. Give it ten chapters, with some fresh eyes, and enjoy it all over again, perhaps even more so than when you were actually playing it...

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3415223

If the link takes you to a forum registration page, they should be adding it to the archive, and I can update with another post then, but I was able to read the whole thread over the years as a lurker.

As with most games that are popular enough, you're gonna get your screaming idiots, they're an awfully vocal bunch. However, I can often appreciate most games for some, often many things. This doesn't make me blind to criticism though, so I can relate to your points here. FF7 had its flaws, but for the time, it was an amazing game, provided you went in blindly. Most good things are best experienced before, or even better, without any hype. In a weird way, the advertising campaign might have had a downside... Speaking of which, the ads I mentioned with gameplay showed brief bits of the battle system. There had to have been at least 10 or 12 different ads for that game though.

Another thought... what was your alternative, if you wanted a console RPG in 1997? Oh... yeah... remember Quest 64? If you do, I'm sorry for bringing it up.

As for FF7 being unlike any FF before, you're right. I loved the cyberpunk atmosphere though, what with Doom on the PC, and Wipeout, getting into Star Wars, some techno and industrial music forming my impressionable teenage mind... I think that's part of what made FF9 so lovable, was this contrast. It was new, it was unfamiliar, but like you said, it was still an FF game.

You mentioned the Gameboy FF titles, and at this point, I feel I should point out that they were all early titles in the Saga series (FF Legend), and the Seiken Densetsu series (FF Adventure), which is better known as Secret of Mana to us westerners. So if it feels like the GB games were a bit of a different horse, well... there ya go.

[te72]

You know something, I realized today, why FF7 struck such a chord in me today. One of the major themes of the game, was that death can come suddenly, and that it isn't glamorous or always an eventful thing.

Well, I lost my best friend to a hit and run accident in January of that year, then my grandma to a short bout with cancer that March. 1997 was a REALLY rough year on me, and to have one of the main characters taken from me like that? That hit me harder than any scene in any movie that I've ever seen. That was Grave of the Fireflies sad, right there.

Although, taken out of context? It's just a game. Depending on your circumstances though, it could hit close to home. Plus, the music made the scene. Watch it on mute, it doesn't carry nearly the weight that it does as when you hear those first couple notes following that "ping" sound...

Anyway, enough of my story, go read Elentor's thread. Especially you Mike, give it some fresh eyes and see if you don't like it again. Ten chapters, that's all I'd ask of your time on this.

[formisc1]

I'm worried how they will butcher the story just to be able to "re-release" the game in 3 different versions.

[consumer]

Final Fantasy is a different game entirely without random encounters, but I don't think its terrible to add options to breath new life into old video games.  Whats left of these old 50+hour monsters but to hack them up and let players experience them in pieces?

[tedart]

I agree.

Mainly when a game is rereleased, remade, re-done, re-mixed, whatever, etc.... the main thing I appreciate is updated graphics, like Zelda Windwaker.

Other than that, I guess having more options is cool, but it's no big deal. As long as the main game isn't messed with too much.

When I play Final Fantasy, I just go back to playing the old original copies. But I understand not everyone can do that.

[daven000]

The changes water the game down. I don't care if it's optional, it's still stupid in principle. If a person doesn't like battles in RPGs then guess what: maybe RPGs just aren't for you then. I don't like, for instance, golf games, and I tend to avoid them as a result. I don't wait for the day when developers make a golf game that abandons golf in an attempt to appeal to non-golf fans.

[kitsunebi]

Rather than eliminate battles and spending all their time focusing on adding fancy new graphics, I wish the developers of JRPGs would put all their effort into making battles something so enjoyable that no one would want to skip them. I don't have a magic solution, but I think one key factor in making battles enjoyable is to make them more difficult and complex. If you can win 90% of the battles just by attacking over and over, then of course you're going to get bored. Introducing a more complicated tactical system requires the player to actually be mentally engaged in the battles in order to win. That's why I prefer tactical JRPGs, but enjoyable tactical battles have been around for ages. Did any of you guys play the "gold box" AD&D PC games back in the late 80s? The battle system in those games, even as primitive as they were, was more enjoyable than your typical JRPG battle because they were often quite difficult and required creative deployment of your party and use of attacks in much more complicated ways than "attack the fire creature with water/ice," which is usually as complex as traditional JRPG battles get.

[Data]

I like a rpg's that let me fight when I want.  I like to explore without being drawn into battles anymore than 30 seconds.

If I choose to get lazy and skip through content, there should be punishment and setbacks.

The game should level you up automatically and reward for extra work.